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ForumForumDiscussionsDiscussionsLiving with nar...Living with nar...Modafinil and alcohol?Modafinil and alcohol?
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 18/04/2012 19:15
 

Sorry; my intention had been to err on the cautious side.

I'm interested by the point that modafinil affects liver enzymes - I've been sporadically having somewhat elevated ones - Gamma GT, definitely, and ALP sometimes (I think it was ALP, aka Alk Phos). This is a concern because my immunosuppressant (for eczema) is hepatotoxic. I'm wondering whether modafinil may be affecting those levels as well. I hadn't come across the idea that modafinil affects liver enzymes before.

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 19/04/2012 09:59
 

No problem at all; we like to take all views here but it's always good to offer a contra view. more important when it's what it says on the box!

Regarding modafinil and higher LFTs this is a known side affect of modafinil. Now, a lot of this is off the top of my head so I might get some of it wrong and certainly the spellings could be way off, but lets see how I do. Modafinil is a racemic compound and as such does have an affect on liver function. It used to say on the patient info that came with it that raised LFTs were not uncommon and there is a dose related increase in alkaline phoshalade and gamma glutanyl transferance. Need to check the spelling on those! So what does that mean? Several liver enzymes can be compromised by modafinil and I think the most common is CYP2C19 which I believe is the one that matabilises hormones and this is over exited and that, I guess is why hormone based birth control is not reccomended with modafinil. It also affects at least two other enzymes CYP450 (which can lead to elevated sgot/alt levels) and CYP3A4 which is the enzyme that breaks down racemic compounds and so is being worked harder than normal to break down modafinil.

Now, one more point, (apart from the faact that I need to get a life and how do I remember this stuff!) CYP3A4 breaks down modafinil but it isn't a very robust enzyme. In fact it can be inhibited by a range of naturaly occuring chemicals in citrus fruit and in particular grapefruit. Now I am not saying do not eat oranges and grapefruit if you are on modafinil but I would certainly avoid regular grapefruit juice if you are on modafinil and certainly never take your modafinil with grapefruit juice. Modafinil has such a low overdose potential I don't know if GPs still say don't take it with grapefruit juice but certainly in America they used to. CYP3A4 is also used to metabolise several other drug compounds so do take care when taking medication with fruit juice.

I should be a doctor.

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 19/04/2012 20:08
 

Hmm, I had an antibiotic at one point that said not to take with grapefruit juice... don't remember seeing that on any of my modafinil leaflets, but until now I hadn't looked at one for ages! I see the mention of liver enzymes - the leaflet says "certain enzymes" on LFTs will be elevated. If I can find something short I can print that specifies which, I'll take it to my dermatologist (who keeps an eye on my LFTs, as there's concern about liver damage from the azathiprine I take for my eczema) so they can stop being paranoid about my raised GGT, at least.

Thanks for this info. Hopefully this will reduce the stress of being threatened with stopping my very effective eczema treatment!

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 24/04/2012 02:27
 

Trisha, Firstly alcohol is a poison, it is that simple, just because people use it to socialise does'nt make it healthy, that is the trick by these producers of poisons, they make you feel you need it to fit in or to have a good night whilst your health suffers and whilst those companies earn from your ill-health to the tune of 40 billion pounds a year. People take cocaine socially, doesn't mean it is good, and I wouldn't listen to a GP that also tells you that a glass a day is god for your blood, that is absolute cow dung. One drop of alcohol, one drop, instantly turns your liver black. It strangles it, is treated like a food and if you have eaten or have taken medication that the liver has to break down aswell , then you are putting even more strain on your liver.
Modafinil has been designed to not have any pleasurable side effects, i.e. you are not going to get high from it, and drinking alcohol whilst on modafinil will not make you feel any better, like some that might take benzodiazepines and then drink alcohol to strengthen the effects, in fact you will probably become bored very quickly, which leads to a boredom migraine and that is not nice, for which some , like I used to, end up taking the RDA of analgesics, which caused my liver to swell to the point where I had to be taken into A and E, my liver had swollen so much that it felt like I had a broken rib. The doctors even asked me if I INJECT heroin, which shocked me.
On grapefruit and citrus fruits, though I don't know much on this subject, I will say that humans that eat a fruit high in acid, believe me, you're liver does not appreciate it. I would go as far as to say that human beings should never eat tomatoes. Some fruits that are high in vitamin C are antagonists to alot of recreational drugs, including speed, so it would be pretty pointless taking an upper ( though Modafinil is not amphetamine based, it must still work with the Amphetamine receptors as it does with the cannabinoid receptors) and then putting ascorbic acid in your blood.
Sam you mentioned that you have eczema, did you have eczema before you started taking modafinil? Are you taking any benzodiazepines as well as modafinil? Your GP should make you aware that you could be making your eczema worse. Maybe you're GP will give you another pill for the side effects of others and then give you another pill for the side effects from the pill taken for the side effects. This is why there were 750 million presriptions handed out to a nation of 65 million. Something isn't adding up.

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 24/04/2012 10:40
 

I was going to redact some of this but have changed my mind as it is about 90% accurate which for Stranded is very good indeed. So where has he over egged it a bit? Well, one drop of alcohol will not turn your liver black unless your liver is in a petri dish and it is 100% alcohol. However he is right that alcohol is a poison when taken in quantity and it can kill you. He is right that head pain is a common side affect of modafinil and alcohol though I have never heard it called a boredom migraine before.

I think not eating tomatoes is Strandeds own decision and I don't know of any paper that says eating tomato as part of a well balanced diet is bad for you. Ditto fruits high in Vit C; a lack of vitamin C is dangerous and can cause scurvey. However taking medication with fruit juice should be avoided if the leaflet says not to do it - as it used to in modafinil and still might. Very good point about eczema and modafinil as skin rashes are a known side effect of modafinil use, especially in children.

Hope this helps.

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